Gay Marriage

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Originally Posted by 99_

:o

you are officially the coolest hxc christian I know :D

I agree with everything you said..

idk, I haven't really read the bible, as I think a lot of it is kinda ridiculous.. but..

I do believe in God.. and I have a bible in my room :p

if only more people were like you :\

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Hello 99,

:-)

I am flattored by your comment. but what does hxc mean? xD. I assumed it meant hardcore, but I just wanted to make sure.

It is cool to hear that you agree with me, as many Christians do not. But, I speak not in accordance to bring myself glory or praise, but give the God who made us and formed us praise and glory. Which he so deserves just by his utter character and beauty. And I pray that this will be your motivation.

Everything I do, I want to do for the glory of God. And I know thats not always the case. I am flawed like all humans, cursed under sinful nature. But it is God's grace and love that sustains me and upholds me, and by that, it gives me much joy. And that is all I have learned to boast in. Is in Christ. Everything else that I boast in, is worthless. Everything that I am or that I have become is by God's grace.

I understand that you think the bible is ridiculous, as I did for many years. It took a big God to convince me otherwise. But, I do think it is the most precious book for a christian to own. It has so dramatically changed my life. The bible is true and a lot it hard to understand and may sound ridiculous, but that is why Christ promised us the Holy Spirit in order to understand it and live by it.

I care about you and that is why I tell you this. someone had to tell me and God used it. :-)

another long write. :/

-corn77

yes it means hard core :p

I don't think the bible is ridiculous, I think how some people interpret it is ridiculous (sorry if I said it bad before =X)..

I think that God made us how we are, so what we do is what he wanted us to do and be.. mostly..

idk.. I just think a lot of people think they know what the bible means and how to be christian, when they think that only what they are doing is right..

like.. "Since your gay, your going against God, so I want to kill you."

people have said that to me before at school..

which, to me, doesn't seem christian at all..

:o

I'm babbling random stuff now.. >.>

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Originally Posted by 99_

yes it means hard core :p

I don't think the bible is ridiculous, I think how some people interpret it is ridiculous (sorry if I said it bad before =X)..

I think that God made us how we are, so what we do is what he wanted us to do and be.. mostly..

idk.. I just think a lot of people think they know what the bible means and how to be christian, when they think that only what they are doing is right..

like.. "Since your gay, your going against God, so I want to kill you."

people have said that to me before at school..

which, to me, doesn't seem christian at all..

:o

I'm babbling random stuff now.. >.>

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Hello again.

:-)

Thanks for responding. I greatly appreciate it.

Oh, I thought you meant the Bible was. Thats ok, many people do think it to be ridiculous and to be false. I am sorry about that misconception, but many Christians do believe that The bible isnt reliable, which is false. It saddens me to see that truth, but God promised it would happen, that falsehood would go about his people and enter in our minds. We believe many lies that come into our heads, me included.

I always am greatful to see your openness and to even share your experiences that alarm you to me. Gives me joy to share of what God has done for me, that He will get glory for it.

I dont know how to interpret the bible. I say that, knowing that it is not I that interprets the bible for me, but it is the Holy Spirit that does it within me. It is the Spirit that guides us to the truth. When we feel like, we are the ones that know how to interpret it, or whatever. Pride builds up, it pushes us away from God. We push away God.

We need God so much, just to help us interpret the bible correctly. We need him for everything!! everything I do, I need God to supernaturally strengthen me. Because we are called to be a weak and humble people under a great and powerful God. And he promises that to us if we are humble and broken before him. But when we are prideful and acting big, he will crush us. Not in a sense to destroy us, but to destroy our pride and to make us a humble people before him, so that we will rely on him. It is such a beautiful picture of God getting glory through us, and us watching him do it and praising him for it. I just love it.

Im going to this cut off here, bc I love to talk about God, but sometimes I need to learn to listen more and not talk. But God is so good to me and his children, I see it daily. And everyday it is new and better than before. Praise God.

It was a pleasure.

-corn77

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Originally Posted by corn77

Hello again.

:-)

Thanks for responding. I greatly appreciate it.

Oh, I thought you meant the Bible was. Thats ok, many people do think it to be ridiculous and to be false. I am sorry about that misconception, but many Christians do believe that The bible isnt reliable, which is false. It saddens me to see that truth, but God promised it would happen, that falsehood would go about his people and enter in our minds. We believe many lies that come into our heads, me included.

I always am greatful to see your openness and to even share your experiences that alarm you to me. Gives me joy to share of what God has done for me, that He will get glory for it.

I dont know how to interpret the bible. I say that, knowing that it is not I that interprets the bible for me, but it is the Holy Spirit that does it within me. It is the Spirit that guides us to the truth. When we feel like, we are the ones that know how to interpret it, or whatever. Pride builds up, it pushes us away from God. We push away God.

We need God so much, just to help us interpret the bible correctly. We need him for everything!! everything I do, I need God to supernaturally strengthen me. Because we are called to be a weak and humble people under a great and powerful God. And he promises that to us if we are humble and broken before him. But when we are prideful and acting big, he will crush us. Not in a sense to destroy us, but to destroy our pride and to make us a humble people before him, so that we will rely on him. It is such a beautiful picture of God getting glory through us, and us watching him do it and praising him for it. I just love it.

Im going to this cut off here, bc I love to talk about God, but sometimes I need to learn to listen more and not talk. But God is so good to me and his children, I see it daily. And everyday it is new and better than before. Praise God.

It was a pleasure.

-corn77

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that part of God has never made sense to me before.. It does now..

people usually happen to leave out the "so that we will rely on him" part :\

I was always really confused on why God would destroy us for growing out of him..

thank you for talking to me :D I have actually read all of your posts entirely (shocking that I would do that, as I don't like reading), and they are brilliant :)

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Originally Posted by 99_

that part of God has never made sense to me before.. It does now..

people usually happen to leave out the "so that we will rely on him" part :\

I was always really confused on why God would destroy us for growing out of him..

thank you for talking to me :D I have actually read all of your posts entirely (shocking that I would do that, as I don't like reading), and they are brilliant :)

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Helloo,

It gave me so much joy to hear that God to used me in order to help you understand how God works amongst his people. There are many things in our lives that tell us lies about God and make us confused. I tend to believe the lies, but God in his grace and power through the holy spirit will guide us to his truth. He promises it.

"God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.."

It is important to understand that God wants us to rely on him. When we were saved by God through Christ. The same faith that had us rely on Christ for forgiveness of sins, will should continue to live in as we rely on him for everything we do in order to know him more.

I was very delighted to speak with you and I have been learning just to encourage Gods children with what he has taught and shown me in my own life. Sometimes I feel like I know nothing, but God is so gracious to me in order to use me and give me some knowledge of Him. I still have so far to go. :-)

But I know God is worth following and obeying. I pray that he will continue to show me his great worth and beauty. It is infinite.

Lol, all my posts are long or seem to be... Praise God. :-)

-corn77

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Originally Posted by corn77

A little white lie and murder are the same in Gods eyes.

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...Seriously?

There are two ways I see this going.

1. You are wrong.

2. You show how ridiculous the bible is.

How could anyone be stupid enough to think that a white lie (an often trivial, diplomatic or well-intentioned untruth) is the same as murder. That's almost the same as saying that your parent told you a white lie and you killed them as equal retaliation.

White lies are "well-intentioned"; Murder isn't.

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Originally Posted by Aser

...Seriously?

There are two ways I see this going.

1. You are wrong.

2. You show how ridiculous the bible is.

How could anyone be stupid enough to think that a white lie (an often trivial, diplomatic or well-intentioned untruth) is the same as murder. That's almost the same as saying that your parent told you a white lie and you killed them as equal retaliation.

White lies are "well-intentioned"; Murder isn't.

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Hello Aser,

I appreciate your honesty on my comment. And I know how it sounds. To us it is evident that murder in human terms is by far much more damaging than a little white lie. And that is not what I am saying at all. I am not trying to justify murder or to decrease it evilness. It is very evil. I am glad that you look at murder that way.

What I am trying to say, is that equally all sin, whether I lie, steal, murder, or whatever. In God's eyes are equally highly detestable in his sight. To God, It is all about the heart, the condition of the heart. Not the physical heart, but as the bible describes the heart. The bible describes that all of our thoughts, desires, and actions come from the heart. According to the bibles, our hearts are very corrupt (examples Genesis 6:5, Jeremiah 7:24). What God sees in the heart, with murder and lying are the same, because they are both rebellious to God, both displeasing, and both out of the same motives.

I would say, even a white lie is masked in selfish motives that are only used to prevent a sitation not to happen. I say this knowing my own motives when I do tell white lies.

James 2:10

10For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

Matthew 15:19

"For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander."


I am greatful to answer anymore questions and if my explanation was confusing to you, please let me know.

corn

Basically you are saying that it is not ok to support someone when they are feeling down or unhappy if you don't care.

Someone is crying in the corner and it annoys me. Am I supposed to say "Shut up, you are annoying as hell,"? No... I should try to help them feel better even if it causes me to tell a lie.

I'm not going to act like a total ass hole just because god thinks that I am a terrible person because I lie to help someone.

I wouldn't tell a person that their parent's divorce was there fault even if I knew it was. I would tell them a lie so they wouldn't have problems later in life.

How could you follow a god that would look the same on a murderer and a good person.

It isn't right to follow something if it causes you to hurt others.

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Originally Posted by Aser

Basically you are saying that it is not ok to support someone when they are feeling down or unhappy if you don't care.

Someone is crying in the corner and it annoys me. Am I supposed to say "Shut up, you are annoying as hell,"? No... I should try to help them feel better even if it causes me to tell a lie.

I'm not going to act like a total ass hole just because god thinks that I am a terrible person because I lie to help someone.

I wouldn't tell a person that their parent's divorce was there fault even if I knew it was. I would tell them a lie so they wouldn't have problems later in life.

How could you follow a god that would look the same on a murderer and a good person.

It isn't right to follow something if it causes you to hurt others.

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Look, hes not saying that you are banished to hell for telling a white lie...

God knows that we sin. We sin every day. However, Jesus sacrificed himself in order for our sins to be washed away. Accepting God into your life and following in the footsteps of Jesus is your way of accepting the gift in which Jesus has offered through his sacrifice.

Whether you have committed murder, adultery, or 100s of white lies... all will be forgiven. All sins are equal, and all sins will be washed away equally.

On a side note; I do believe that it is alright to tell a white lie when it benefits the other person instead of yourself.

this isn't religion, it's gay marriage, so in an attempt to get us back on topic, I feel that gay people should be able to do what they want. I feel they are normal people just as anybody else, and noone should be able to say they aren't allowed to get married, it's like saying because of your preference, we are taking a right away. It's kind of like how black people used to not be able to vote, was there a reason for that? no, it was just to hold them back from something because of racist people. I feel that homophobes just don't let them get married for the same reason blacks couldn't vote many years ago. It is their choice (may not be worded right, because most gay people don't choose to be gay, but just are) to be gay or do what they want, in America who are we to say they aren't allowed to marry someone they love, whether it be the same or opposite sex. I think it is completely unfair for gay marriage to be illegal, and that people should stop being such homophobes and accept that people are gay, and are going to stay gay and want to marry their lover. I have no problems with gays or them getting married, the only thing that would bother me a little bit is if I was walking through a park or something and saw some gay guys making out, but I'd just try to ignore it, and I'd be bothered if a gay guy hit on me knowing I'm straight. So as long as they don't hit on me and do things I'd rather not watch right in front of me, then I'm fine, they can do whatever they want, I just prefer not to be around.

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Originally Posted by Baked0420

I have no problems with gays or them getting married, the only thing that would bother me a little bit is if I was walking through a park or something and saw some gay guys making out, but I'd just try to ignore it, and I'd be bothered if a gay guy hit on me knowing I'm straight. So as long as they don't hit on me and do things I'd rather not watch right in front of me, then I'm fine, they can do whatever they want, I just prefer not to be around.

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I agree with the rest of your post...

The only problem is that being uncomfortable with them is just a small step from not accepting them. It is good that you are for them having rights, but the problems you have with them are problems that people use as reasons to deny them rights.

"Gays shouldn't have rights because I don't want them to hit on me" is the most common excuse. Gays aren't rapists. Being gay doesn't mean they will push the issue or stalk you, just say no. That is a personality thing. Anyone could have it, not just homosexual people.

@Baked- I am really glad that you are accepting enough to want them to have rights. That is way more than most people give, but just remember, as long as you are uncomfortable with them around, you won't truly be accepting them.

I think they deserve the same rights the rest of us do... I mean there really isn't much of a difference, the only thing is that we like different people(girls/boys). But I really don't get how a difference this small can cause such riots and uproars whenever this gets mentioned on the news and such. I don't see why some people can't just accept the fact that some people are different than others. But it's kind of like in the 1960s when colored people were discriminated, I think soon this problem will hopefully be resolved :)

I'm sick and tired of hearing about gay rights. Please STFU. Your decision to be gay is a personal choice. I do not care if you or someone else is gay, live your life how you wish to.

Regardless of your religious beliefs, being gay "does not work"(for lack of better terms). Male and females make babies. Simple as that. Thats how every human on this earth body is made.

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Originally Posted by _ChArMz

Regardless of your religious beliefs, being gay "does not work"(for lack of better terms). Male and females make babies. Simple as that. Thats how every human on this earth body is made.

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Hello ChArMz,

I appreciate your bluntness with this topic of discussion and I in a sense would agree with what you are saying.

It is quite true that being gay doesn't work. This is basic knowledge, I do not have to argue this point and I am not trying to discredit people who would consider themselves gay. Men and Woman are simply made to be the ones to live together as one.

Decisions, thats what it seems what is it all about. It is our own decision to decide what is true in our own lives. The question then is therefore, what is most benficial motive of our decisions, is it for our happiness, our own pleasure, selfishness?? Is that the best motive? or is there something greater that all of us are missing?

I feel like I have nothing more to add on it.

corn

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Originally Posted by Yakman

i have to disagree with you very much there. Sexuality is not a choise, I didnt choose mine and I'm almost certain that you're born with it or something.

I'm sure you've heard of some women (especially feminists) saying "I would be a lesbian if i could choose"



As for keeping it out the streets. You dont see hetrosexual people having sex in the streets, its always confused me why some people expect homosexuals to do it.
I prefer to do it in private as much as you.

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Don't try that. It's a choice, you know it.

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Originally Posted by TViYH

Don't try that. It's a choice, you know it.

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Lol, you got trolled by Yakman. He said on the IRC before that he is not gay, he was just using the setting as an example to help people visualize how life would be for gays.

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Originally Posted by TViYH

Don't try that. It's a choice, you know it.

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With that logic, you should be able to make yourself be attracted to men also. Can you?

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Originally Posted by TViYH

Don't try that. It's a choice, you know it.

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so you're telling me you can suck dick and choose to enjoy it?


if i asked you, im sure you wouldnt be able to explain to me why you find women attrative, you would probably resort to some vague thing like, "its natural".

but you didnt choose to fancy women, and in exactly the same way, gay men dont choose to fancy men.

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Originally Posted by _ChArMz

I'm sick and tired of hearing about gay rights. Please STFU. Your decision to be gay is a personal choice. I do not care if you or someone else is gay, live your life how you wish to.

Regardless of your religious beliefs, being gay "does not work"(for lack of better terms). Male and females make babies. Simple as that. Thats how every human on this earth body is made.

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If that's so then shouldn't all the gay people go away by just waiting a generation? I find men completely sexually unattractive and I'd rather not be hit on by them, but I'd be a hypocrite if I said they shouldn't be allowed to do it. There are quite a few women that I wouldn't want hitting on me too :<.

So much for "Land of the free". This is one of the things I don't get about both main political parties, both are out to restrict certain groups of people while insisting that they're promoting "freedom", especially when it comes to things like invading other countries.

Anyway, I think people should be able to decide themselves how to hold a relationship. If they do it "normally", so be it. If they're into bondage, whatever. If they like furries, who really cares. And if they're gay, it's not really all that different. Neither a gay man nor woman are going to have a kid themselves unless they involve heterosexual practices (although there's sperm banks and adoption centers). I think some of this is just that people are upset that parental roles get confused in the process (a lesbian couple would have two mother figures, and a gay (male) couple would probably have two father figures which could influence their children one way or the other), but regular working practices can be seen as worse than this even (when both parents work full-time jobs then after a day of daycare they still neglect their children, and thus the children have no parental figures at all and are only influenced by peers and teachers).

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Originally Posted by Yakman

so you're telling me you can suck dick and choose to enjoy it?


if i asked you, im sure you wouldnt be able to explain to me why you find women attrative, you would probably resort to some vague thing like, "its natural".

but you didnt choose to fancy women, and in exactly the same way, gay men dont choose to fancy men.

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It actually is natural. The copulents their bodies give off make our brain attracted to them. Scientifically speaking.

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Originally Posted by TViYH

It actually is natural. The copulents their bodies give off make our brain attracted to them. Scientifically speaking.

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Its natural for that person. Thats how their brain works. For a gay person, being attracted to men is natural. For paedophiles, being attracted to children is how their brain works.

Natural is too vague

So, tell me what causes one to be gay. Tell me why they are attracted to men. Tell me that.

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Originally Posted by TViYH

It actually is natural. The copulents their bodies give off make our brain attracted to them. Scientifically speaking.

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oooo, look who thinks they are good at science.

copulents spread by smell only.
That doesnt explain why you can be attracted to someone by talking to them over the phone, or by sending them letters or talking on IM.

if it was only copulents, porn would not work because it doesnt give you that smell.

if it was only copulents, people with no sense of smell would never feel attracted.


you, TViYH, are a very dogmatic, narrowminded and i daresay stupid person, which you've shown by your last few posts.

Most people are not actually attracted to other people. They are: "attracted" by lust, pressure, or some other cause.

But the actual physical attractant are copulents and chemical smells.

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Originally Posted by TViYH

But the actual physical attractant are copulents and chemical smells.

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As stated by YakMan, 'then how does porn work'?

ok im not gay but i dont think being gay is a sin as taught by religions

casue from i understand its not a choice which mean it cant be a sin becasue u chose to a do a sin

also if its a sin god wouldnt have people able to be gay becasue he doesnt create sin peopel create

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Originally Posted by noidea

As stated by YakMan, 'then how does porn work'?

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Porn is lust, it's not actual physical attraction. You want the person, you imagine you are with them, you seeing the image sets something off in the bring which triggers, err, blood to rush to your penis.

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Originally Posted by jpizzle

ok im not gay but i dont think being gay is a sin as taught by religions

casue from i understand its not a choice which mean it cant be a sin becasue u chose to a do a sin

also if its a sin god wouldnt have people able to be gay becasue he doesnt create sin peopel create

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Gay != Sin. Doing Gay Stuff == Sin. That is mormon/lds standpoint. I don't judge anyone though, because I do dumb stuff too(not gay though).

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Originally Posted by mormonman

Gay != Sin. Doing Gay Stuff == Sin. That is mormon/lds standpoint. I don't judge anyone though, because I do dumb stuff too(not gay though).

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tht was the point of my post tht religions think being gay is a sin when it isnt becasue god doesnt create sin and it isnt a choice

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Originally Posted by jpizzle

tht was the point of my post tht religions think being gay is a sin when it isnt becasue god doesnt create sin and it isnt a choice

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i don't think you know java? != is not equal... == is equal.

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Originally Posted by mormonman

i don't think you know java? != is not equal... == is equal.

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u lost me

ru talking about the programing java or wut csue i relel dont understand it

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Originally Posted by TViYH

Porn is lust, it's not actual physical attraction. You want the person, you imagine you are with them, you seeing the image sets something off in the bring which triggers, err, blood to rush to your penis.

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oh, this is a big revelation.

so you only disapprove of homosexual love, but not lust.

which means its perfectly alright to sleep with many guys, as long as you dont love them, according to you?



if porn isnt physical attraction, then what is it?



anyway, back to point.
its not just porn, you can love someone without smelling them? For example over the phone, letters, etc etc etc
and how can people with no sense of smell love?


love is not something temporary that lasts only as long as you can smell the person, its a feeling built up over time which continues even if you're seperated by massive distances.

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Originally Posted by jpizzle

u lost me

ru talking about the programing java or wut csue i relel dont understand it

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yes, java programming.

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Originally Posted by mormonman

yes, java programming.

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then can u put what u were trying to say in normal language and not java so i can understand what u were saying

I completely agree with you, it would be discrimination to not let you get married o.O.

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Originally Posted by jpizzle

then can u put what u were trying to say in normal language and not java so i can understand what u were saying

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being gay isn't a sin, but doing gay stuff is. <----- mormon belief

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Originally Posted by mormonman

being gay isn't a sin, but doing gay stuff is. <----- mormon belief

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gotcha

i dont beleive that is but w/e im not gonna get in a fight over it casue its your belief and everyone is entitled to there beliefs

so lets leave it a thtat

We live in a hypocritical world, especially the west we not more then 20 percent of the worlds population preaching the rest of the world proclaiming our wester moral believes are today's standard the superior truth.
Democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of the individual and emancipation are some of our most valued philosophical treasures.
Yet in our own backyard we shackle those who are different we limit them in their choices, the hypocrisy.

This should not be a debate about whether being gay is a choice, (un)moral, (non)ethical but a self confronting question "are we wise enough to build on the pillars of our western philosophy?".

Being gay is a personal matter, but we cloud our minds with social cohesive believes and that is what limit us, will we ever learn?

Until then i can only wish you luck Yachoman, believe and fight for your rights because in the end only you can determine if the path you follow is right or wrong.

i feel the goverment is unfair with homesexuals. thair no diffrent then straits are. they desurv the same rights as we do. we are all the same on the inside.

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Originally Posted by sk8terbitu

i feel the goverment is unfair with homesexuals. thair no diffrent then straits are. they desurv the same rights as we do. we are all the same on the inside.

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No were not for all we know we can all have different colored guts and stuff and all around i just hate homosexuals and when i see them i almost barf and just hope i never have to see another homosexual so hopefully chuck will take care of them all. :norris: