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Thread: Has the community changed its view on "Gold Farming" ?

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    Default Has the community changed its view on "Gold Farming" ?

    I remember back when I first started using Simba there was a general view that gold farming was bad ( might have been an old thread can't remember )

    has that view changed?

    is the SRL community more open to gold farming, or is it still taboo thing to do?

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    nope

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    Quote Originally Posted by rj View Post
    nope
    wouldn't that be a contradiction with the subsection ' money making ' in script section? because those scripts are mainly no requirements and pure cash/hr

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    Quote Originally Posted by theholyone View Post
    wouldn't that be a contradiction with the subsection ' money making ' in script section? because those scripts are mainly no requirements and pure cash/hr
    Good luck gold farming with any of those scripts.

    I don't have a problem with it if you write your own scripts and keep it to yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Citrus View Post
    Good luck gold farming with any of those scripts.

    I don't have a problem with it if you write your own scripts and keep it to yourself.
    this is pretty much the stance everyone has @ OP

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    Quote Originally Posted by rj View Post
    this is pretty much the stance everyone has @ OP

    It's just kind of confusing for me...

    I had a necessity for recharging glories, so I wrote a script for it.
    turns out its about pretty decent THEORETICAL GP/hr ( around 1.5-1.7m/hr ) ( tried to sell glories overnight but they didn't all sell )

    wouldn't this be a clear " gold farming " script since its all GP/HR and no XP?

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    Quote Originally Posted by theholyone View Post
    wouldn't this be a clear " gold farming " script since its all GP/HR and no XP?
    I wouldn't consider it to be a viable gold farming method because as you said
    ( tried to sell glories overnight but they didn't all sell )
    If you could run 4 accounts 24/7 and get that kind of profit then you'd have a decent farm. But again I wouldn't have a problem if you did the work yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theholyone View Post
    It's just kind of confusing for me...

    I had a necessity for recharging glories, so I wrote a script for it.
    turns out its about pretty decent THEORETICAL GP/hr ( around 1.5-1.7m/hr ) ( tried to sell glories overnight but they didn't all sell )

    wouldn't this be a clear " gold farming " script since its all GP/HR and no XP?
    GoldFarming requires sustainability. I can make yew logs or astral runes or most things 24/7 and still make money.

    If you can make 1.5m in an hour that does not mean its a 1.5m/hr money making method.]

    So if you were to release this script I'm sure no one would care at all.

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    The stance has not changed and probably never will. Goldfarming goes against a lot of what the SRL community stands for.

    This community is about learning, not about making a quick buck.

    If one wishes to devalue oneself, one's skills, and what one has learned from this community by trying to turn a profit, good for them. Go right ahead.

    Nobody will stop them. But nobody will enable them, either. Don't expect to get help from us on a project that will be used for goldfarming. Provided that one keeps to oneself, the community will not take issue with them, because they've not handed us an issue with which to take.

    But as soon as one unloads unload any goldfarming-related baggage on us, be prepared to be torn apart by peeved community members.

    This is a general comment in regards to to anything that involves making money from SRL: we don't like it. Don't take it anywhere near us, and we won't get in your face.

    But as soon as an individual attempts to grease their palm by using the treasures this community provides, that individual has transgressed.

    One should remember this when one goldfarms with Simba: they have done nothing meaningful, created nothing meaningful, and accomplished nothing meaningful.
    The community has done all of the heavy lifting, and has provided the program, the include, and the client -- everything one is using for their own personal gain.

    The above only becomes truer when one buys a script to use for goldfarming. That's two cardinal sins at one time, and it cuts out the 0.1% of collective effort that one may have expended, had they written their own script.

    Disclaimer: non-specific pronouns such as "one" and "they" are used throughout this strongly-worded post to avoid inadvertently casting blame unto OP or anybody else
    Last edited by KeepBotting; 09-11-2015 at 10:06 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeepBotting View Post
    The stance has not changed and probably never will. Goldfarming goes against a lot of what the SRL community stands for.

    This community is about learning, not about making a quick buck.

    If one wishes to devalue oneself, one's skills, and what one has learned from this community by trying to turn a profit, good for them. Go right ahead.

    Nobody will stop them. But nobody will enable them, either. Don't expect to get help from us on a project that will be used for goldfarming. Provided that one keeps to oneself, the community will not take issue with them, because they've not handed us an issue with which to take.

    But as soon as one unloads unload any goldfarming-related baggage on us, be prepared to be torn apart by peeved community members.

    This is a general comment in regards to to anything that involves making money from SRL: we don't like it. Don't take it anywhere near us, and we won't get in your face.

    But as soon as an individual attempts to grease their palm by using the treasures this community provides, that individual has transgressed.

    One should remember this when one goldfarms with Simba: they have done nothing meaningful, created nothing meaningful, and accomplished nothing meaningful.
    The community has done all of the heavy lifting, and has provided the program, the include, and the client -- everything one is using for their own personal gain.

    The above only becomes truer when one buys a script to use for goldfarming. That's two cardinal sins at one time, and it cuts out the 0.1% of collective effort that one may have expended, had they written their own script.

    Disclaimer: non-specific pronouns such as "one" and "they" are used throughout this strongly-worded post to avoid inadvertently casting blame unto OP or anybody else
    I disagree with pretty much everything you've written in this post, but I don't think it's worth arguing about whether or not gold farming scripts should be allowed (or why scripts that make gold for the user somehow make that user morally corrupt, as if personal gain is a terrible thing; we all use scripts to advance our Runescape accounts, do we not?). That said, I strongly disagree with this concept of "because you used pre-existing technology and tools, your work is essentially nothing". It makes no sense. That is how we, as a species, advance. We don't have to rediscover the concept of "zero" every generation; it's something we have already discovered and built upon for hundreds or thousands of years (depending on when you think zero came into existence).

    League of Legends uses Adobe Air (as well as C++, Lua, C#, ActionScript, Java, Erlang, PHP and Sql, perhaps others). Does that mean all the credit for League should go to Adobe and the creators of the other tools, because they used a technology that was developed by someone else? Valve recently rolled out DotA 2 to the Source 2 Engine permanently; Source 2 was written in C++. Should DotA 2 be credited to Bjarne Stroustrup, the creator of C++? An example closer to home - Clarity wrote (among other things) a Mud Rune crafter using Simba, the SRL-6 include, and SMART. It is at least 1600 lines long (my copy is closer to 1700, but I'm not sure what the original copy has) and can execute it's task for at least 10+ hours at a time with no human interaction and essentially no errors. Has he accomplished nothing meaningful simply because the script makes use of Simba, SRL-6 and SMART? Do the creators of those tools deserve all the credit? When it broke (as it's pretty old), I put effort in to fix it and get it into a working state again. Did I do nothing meaningful, because I used the base of his script and fixed it instead of starting over and writing it all myself?

    I challenge you to find me one thing in modern society that was created from absolutely nothing without any outside help. I would be willing to bet this *never* happened; that absolutely nothing in this world is created without using the work of other people (even as simple - and as important - as the concept of "Zero") to create and improve. The accomplishments of one person are no less valuable or useful because they rely on the work of other people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adc View Post
    snip
    Pretty much this. I won't go into repeating each of your points, but for the most part you're right on.

    As far as the OP and goldfarming, it's no secret that I'm a full-time goldfarmer...it's my actual job, and I use Simba to do it. I used to have a progress thread, but then I realized people were using it to copy my exact method and ban evasion techniques, so I took it down. All throughout that thread was nothing but support from the community, save for a couple trolls but that's to be expected. I began goldfarming for the "right" reasons, if there is a right reason, and not simply out of greed or spite. So that's why for the most part my goldfarm was supported here. Your reasons for running a farm may or may not be the same as mine, so support/contempt may vary for you. We have several high-profile goldfarmers in the community, (high-profile as in, well-known members, not their farms.) so it's not like goldfarming is going to get you banned here, in the average case.

    I would say that as long as you're smart and mature about it, you won't get much heat from it. But if you're an idiot purposely trying to crash markets, suck every last dime out of a method, dry up supplies, etc. then you will probably catch hell, and rightly so. Good luck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adc View Post
    I disagree with pretty much everything you've written in this post, but I don't think it's worth arguing about whether or not gold farming scripts should be allowed (or why scripts that make gold for the user somehow make that user morally corrupt, as if personal gain is a terrible thing; we all use scripts to advance our Runescape accounts, do we not?). That said, I strongly disagree with this concept of "because you used pre-existing technology and tools, your work is essentially nothing". It makes no sense. That is how we, as a species, advance. We don't have to rediscover the concept of "zero" every generation; it's something we have already discovered and built upon for hundreds or thousands of years (depending on when you think zero came into existence).

    League of Legends uses Adobe Air (as well as C++, Lua, C#, ActionScript, Java, Erlang, PHP and Sql, perhaps others). Does that mean all the credit for League should go to Adobe and the creators of the other tools, because they used a technology that was developed by someone else? Valve recently rolled out DotA 2 to the Source 2 Engine permanently; Source 2 was written in C++. Should DotA 2 be credited to Bjarne Stroustrup, the creator of C++? An example closer to home - Clarity wrote (among other things) a Mud Rune crafter using Simba, the SRL-6 include, and SMART. It is at least 1600 lines long (my copy is closer to 1700, but I'm not sure what the original copy has) and can execute it's task for at least 10+ hours at a time with no human interaction and essentially no errors. Has he accomplished nothing meaningful simply because the script makes use of Simba, SRL-6 and SMART? Do the creators of those tools deserve all the credit? When it broke (as it's pretty old), I put effort in to fix it and get it into a working state again. Did I do nothing meaningful, because I used the base of his script and fixed it instead of starting over and writing it all myself?

    I challenge you to find me one thing in modern society that was created from absolutely nothing without any outside help. I would be willing to bet this *never* happened; that absolutely nothing in this world is created without using the work of other people (even as simple - and as important - as the concept of "Zero") to create and improve. The accomplishments of one person are no less valuable or useful because they rely on the work of other people.
    To each his own. I have a very strong moral issue with using free software or others' work solely to turn a profit. If you don't, and can justify it, more power to you.

    Like I said, don't advertise what you do and nobody will care one way or the other. I think no less of you for posting your thoughts. You have a right to your opinion.

    If you'd like to have a civil, public discussion about this, let me know and I will craft a response to your points. Otherwise I'll decline to comment on them, though rest assured I have read and considered them.
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    tl;dr: We havent had an issue with jagex in 8 or so years (i forget) because we attempt to blend in, to not disrupt anyone, to be... just... like... you. (you being the non botting players)

    Anyway, to all the gold farmers, get a f*cking job. dont claim sitting at home all day and running bots and stuff is a job (are you paying income tax (most likely not), so are you really a contributing member of society?). 'oh the government is so bad for taking 26% of my money that i earned, they didnt do anything for me.' Look, i get it. 26% right off the bat (as well as an increase as you make more) is a bitch, but im over it. if thats still how you feel, stop using any public service. ie roads. where the hell would you be without roads? without roads, would you even exist? The answer is no.

    so, tl;dr, tl;dr, gold farming is bad and you should feel bad.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turpinator View Post
    tl;dr: We havent had an issue with jagex in 8 or so years (i forget) because we attempt to blend in, to not disrupt anyone, to be... just... like... you. (you being the non botting players)

    Anyway, to all the gold farmers, get a f*cking job. dont claim sitting at home all day and running bots and stuff is a job (are you paying income tax (most likely not), so are you really a contributing member of society?). 'oh the government is so bad for taking 26% of my money that i earned, they didnt do anything for me.' Look, i get it. 26% right off the bat (as well as an increase as you make more) is a bitch, but im over it. if thats still how you feel, stop using any public service. ie roads. where the hell would you be without roads? without roads, would you even exist? The answer is no.

    so, tl;dr, tl;dr, gold farming is bad and you should feel bad.
    Do you ever actually think your posts through, or do you just post the first thing that comes to mind? I mean, beyond the fact you blatantly don't know the definition of the word job, nothing you said makes any sense at all.

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    Most people here are against goldfarming as it ruins the fun for a lot of people.

    Not to mention that most goldfarming methods ruin the game for legits. The ones that don't effect the legits that much give very little profit/hour, or have large requirements that are difficult to bot.

    Plenty of other ways to make more money, if that is your intention anyway.

    State of goldfarming much worse back then https://villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83312
    Quote Originally Posted by theholyone View Post
    I remember back when I first started using Simba there was a general view that gold farming was bad ( might have been an old thread can't remember )

    has that view changed?

    is the SRL community more open to gold farming, or is it still taboo thing to do?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turpinator View Post
    Anyway, to all the gold farmers, get a f*cking job. dont claim sitting at home all day and running bots and stuff is a job (are you paying income tax (most likely not), so are you really a contributing member of society?).
    I think you better try walking a mile in someone else's shoes before you dare judge them on ANYTHING regarding their own life. You don't know the first thing about me, or anyone else who runs a goldfarm. I've told my story here before, so I'll spare everyone the novel, but I'll tell you just like I told the last smart-mouthed kid that rode in on a high horse...walking in my shoes would break you, little man. At your age, still in or fresh out of college, you don't have the first freaking clue what real life is all about. Wow, you got an education...good for you. So did I. You have a neat little plan for your life...good for you. So did I. When real life happens and screws your cute little plan, you can do one of two things...give up, or do whatever you have to do to get back up. So how dare you judge ANYONE on how they choose to fight their way back to their feet.

    And as for your little ramble about taxes...Do you honestly think I can make 10's of thousands of dollars just disappear like it never happened? I pay a much higher tax rate on my goldfarm earnings than your petty little 26%, as I'm considered self-employed. As of this point in my life I would venture a guess that I've paid more in state taxes in my time than your total earned income to date, let alone my federal taxes. So I suggest you think twice about telling ME to get off the roads.

    Now, you can go ahead and take the "high road" and pretend I jumped down your throat for no reason, but the next time you imply that someone you don't know the first thing about is a worthless human being and a bane to society, you better know what the hell you're talking about.

    tl;dr quit being a judgmental little prick

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    I think if a script is released in the public scripts section, then the public can use those scripts in anyway they like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KeepBotting View Post
    To each his own. I have a very strong moral issue with using free software or others' work solely to turn a profit. If you don't, and can justify it, more power to you.

    Like I said, don't advertise what you do and nobody will care one way or the other. I think no less of you for posting your thoughts. You have a right to your opinion.

    If you'd like to have a civil, public discussion about this, let me know and I will craft a response to your points. Otherwise I'll decline to comment on them, though rest assured I have read and considered them.
    And the fact is simba is a very small (Community and developer wise) project and people making money off it has put some of the developers off. Which is a huge blow to simba, just look at the git commits for this year. It's quite sad
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    Basically, +1 to everything to @KeepBotting; said, with the added clarification that everything that has been developed in the last ten years at SRL has been given to the world for free despite the fact that many of our best developers could make a killing if they kept this work to themselves and sold it as closed source botting programs. When you gold farm purely out of greed, you're going against the wishes of several hundred past and present developers of SCAR, Simba, SRL, and the core values that this entire community was built upon.

    The only way that you're not going to be considered a leech for your goldfarming is if you're an active, heavy contributor to the community. There are several highly respected members of this community with gold farms, but they've dedicated hundreds of hours of their lives to the Simba and SRL projects, and continue to do so. That is the difference.

    EDIT: @Gunner; your circumstances are just a little different. You're not goldfarming out of greed, you're doing it out of necessity. That's why your thread was excepted and the majority of us had/have no problems with you.
    Last edited by Incurable; 09-12-2015 at 10:00 AM.



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    What about just using multiple accounts to fund a main (NOT selling the gold) . what is the community's view on that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mohsen View Post
    What about just using multiple accounts to fund a main (NOT selling the gold) . what is the community's view on that?
    From looking at the general responses in this thread, it should be fine. You are funding your game experience, not your IRL circumstances.

    That's my point of view anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turpinator View Post
    tl;dr: We havent had an issue with jagex in 8 or so years (i forget) because we attempt to blend in, to not disrupt anyone, to be... just... like... you. (you being the non botting players)

    Anyway, to all the gold farmers, get a f*cking job. dont claim sitting at home all day and running bots and stuff is a job (are you paying income tax (most likely not), so are you really a contributing member of society?). 'oh the government is so bad for taking 26% of my money that i earned, they didnt do anything for me.' Look, i get it. 26% right off the bat (as well as an increase as you make more) is a bitch, but im over it. if thats still how you feel, stop using any public service. ie roads. where the hell would you be without roads? without roads, would you even exist? The answer is no.

    so, tl;dr, tl;dr, gold farming is bad and you should feel bad.
    Not at all sure why this post got so much hate? While there might be certain circumstances in which this might not be the case (I guess?), this is pretty well put for the majority of goldfarmer's out there. Making money off of a game while doing something that is against the games rules, while hurting the game for actual players doesn't seem like that great of a career IMO, but I suppose to each their own.. Especially when said people are making the money via using software/resources that other people, who don't get paid a penny, actually coded and created, but that is a discussion for another time..
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    Quote Originally Posted by elfyyy View Post
    Not at all sure why this post got so much hate? While there might be certain circumstances in which this might not be the case (I guess?), this is pretty well put for the majority of goldfarmer's out there. Making money off of a game while doing something that is against the games rules, while hurting the game for actual players doesn't seem like that great of a career IMO, but I suppose to each their own.. Especially when said people are making the money via using software/resources that other people, who don't get paid a penny, actually coded and created, but that is a discussion for another time..
    Because the vast majority of it is totally irrelevant or nonsensical. If you want to make an argument for whether or not it's a moral way to make money (though why we're discussing morals on a website meant, in large part, for cheating in an online game is beyond me) then by all means, do that. But that's not what he did. Instead he started throwing around logical fallacies like he found them in the bargain bin, making up things that the "opposition" has said, and saying things that, frankly, make no sense. "Without roads, would you even exist? The answer is no." wot?

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    Gold farming really does noting useful whatsoever, and it is just pointless and meaningless

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    I believe it's just helping people do something they get absolutely no enjoyment or find zero value in doing... because if you find no value in something, why do it at all? amirite?

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