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Thread: Official 10 December RS Update Thread.

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    Default Official 10 December RS Update Thread.

    This looks bad for us. Discuss.

    As the game has grown, the demand for gold has grown with it, so it is worth gold-sellers' time to make smarter bots. "We keep developing technologies to combat bots, but it's like an arms race – we stop bots, they improve their macros, we stop them, they improve again," says Andrew. The longer we keep doing this, the harder it's going to be to keep stopping bots. "If we don't break that vicious cycle now, it would just keep getting worse and worse. It could reach a point where macro software becomes undetectable."

    Who ya gonna call?

    We have various Customer Support units set up to deal with the problem. Two of these are the Snapshot and Ban Appeal Team (SBAT), which investigates player-submitted Abuse Reports, and the Community Management team. Community Management's Jagex Moderators regularly root out and instantly ban as many bots as they can find - we call this bot-busting. The Player Moderators and Forum Moderators help us to identify bots in game and on the Forums, respectively.

    Another is the Investigations into the Community Unit (ICU), which looks into account theft, macros, bugs and exploits, takes down gold-selling websites and more. ICU's Mod Chris81 says, "All Customer Support teams combined, we're banning tens of thousands of accounts each month that belong to real-world traders. Most of these are bots, but we also secure many accounts that real-world traders have stolen, and return them to their rightful owners." Every plausible idea mentioned on our Forums on how to remove bots, we have considered, tried or already use – for instance, we do ban IPs. We've also involved our lawyers and even talked to certain governments!

    During 2006, we banned bot and real-world trader accounts carrying RuneScape gold and items worth over 200 billion gp. During 2007, so far, we've banned over 525 billion, which has a real-world value of over $2.6 million US - that's an increase of over 250%. At that rate of growth, we'd be looking at banning over 8 trillion gp in 2010 - that's 8,000 billion gp - which has a real-world value of over $40 million US. It's an almost unbelievably high number, but it hammers home the sheer size of the problem we are facing and why we have to take action against it.

    Finish the fight

    "The Player and Forum Moderators, and other legitimate players, have put in a lot of effort and deserve recognition."

    Mod Paul M
    Community Management - Player Moderator Unit

    Community Management's Mod Paul M says, "For a long time, players have thought we're not doing anything, as they don't see everything we do. We've been working on this problem every single day." Bot-busting is our most visible method, but not the most effective. If we ban one bot, it's easy to create a new account to take its place. It's better to take the time to track that account and find every other account it's linked to, then ban all of them at once. Mod Rob, Customer Support Operations Manager, adds, "We still regularly go bot-busting, though, so players can see we are doing something."

    Mod Rob continues: "We have automatic and manual systems in place to identify bots, but limited resources to deal with them. It isn't possible to find and ban every single one." Mod Paul M follows with, "The Player and Forum Moderators, and other legitimate players, have put in a lot of effort and deserve recognition. They see more than we ever could, so we follow up on as many Abuse Reports as possible."

    Unfortunately, these methods are reactive – find a problem then solve it – and if we just react, we'll always be chipping away at a larger problem. Even if we spent every penny we earn on staff and systems to ban bots – which would mean no game updates – gold-sellers would still massively outnumber us. Mod Hobagoly says, "Every time we double our efforts, gold-sellers quadruple theirs. We can't continue only using our current methods, throwing more and more resources at it." The only way we can win is to be proactive and take the fight to them.

    Removing unbalanced trade

    Taking into account how serious this issue is and knowing that reactive methods could never completely stop real-world trading, what are the proactive solutions? Well, considering how much money is involved, one solution would have been to allow real-world trading. Why not just let players sell their RuneScape gold and items and take a small cut of the profits ourselves? "We've seen other MMOGs take that route and it works, but only to a limited extent. Some players would sell gold through their own website to avoid paying the developer a cut. Worse than that, the demand for gold was still mostly being met by players using bots and scams, ruining the experience for legitimate players," says Mod Chris81.

    Mod Hobagoly says, "It would be very difficult to find a way of allowing players to buy RuneScape items for real money that doesn't cheapen the game." There might be some way of doing this, and without all the negatives, but it wasn't the right solution for ridding RuneScape of real-world traders and bots. Andrew follows with, "We looked at any number of different possible solutions. We've read independent studies and spoken with other people in the MMOG industry. Ultimately, the consensus is that the only way to remove the real-world trading market is to develop your game so you cannot make unbalanced trades."

    An unbalanced trade is where one player trades something of value to another player, but does not receive something back of roughly equal value. Real-world traders have used this method to trade millions of gold pieces in exchange for nothing in game, as they will already have been paid in real money. Removing unbalanced trade will mean real-world traders can't do this, so there is no way for them to deliver gold to buyers - and if you can't sell gold, why bother farming it in the first place?

    These gold-sellers are businessmen. They're in it for the money and are going to be looking at the bottom line: their profits. Mod Mark says, "The key phrase is 'not profitable'. We're changing our game in a way that doesn't negatively affect its gameplay, but which makes real-world trading not worth the effort." It's a bold move to make, and one that no other MMO developer has attempted. We are fully aware of how the RuneScape community will react to such a change, which is why we been worked hard to find the best way to implement it.
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    This looks really bad i can't see anyway around it but i'd love to see if anyone else has ideas and such about this.
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    I am at the bounty place right now and its fucking pathetic this game is totally ruined!!!!!


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    As I posted in another thread:
    With all due respect, I think Jagex is destroying the game. For legits aswell as cheaters.

    I'm glad this isn't fully affecting SCAR, since we have more reliable methods than other bots.

    -Knives

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    The thing is whether we still auto or not it is for nothing because we can't give our stuff to our mains to be rich which is why we make new accounts to auto anyway.


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    What the hell? You mean this will make me unable to even help out my friend...?!

    Crap, Jagex, crap.

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    Ya, it looks like autoing on my main in a safe way is the only way to get those resources I need. I am hopeing we can find a loop-hole around this situtation.

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    Someone please lock the other threads regarding this ?


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    very bad news, jagex killed all cheating with these updates

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    No, it just blocked getting your main TONNES of RSGP.

    You can still:
    1) Auto for own characters skills
    2) Auto for own characters resources
    3) Auto for own characters money

    Still, this limits horribly much, and maybe even more for legit players. But I think Jagex are too naive and too blind to really see what they are doing.

    -Knives

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    Jagex cant be so dumb to let the unbalance trade to 3K GP, thats SOOOOO stupid.... I bet the will increase that amount couze there will be a lot of players that are goin to stop playin

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    WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY THINKING?!?!?!?!!??!?!?!!?!!??!?!?!?
    SHIFT + 1 ffs!!!shift+1!111!!

    Now, what is going to happen to pking?

    Not that I wouldn't enjoy going to rape the wilderness armed to teeth, but when the guy dies no, I am not gonna get any loot!

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    As Knives said ''they are killing RS'' i think same thing... if they destroy autoing, well its good for them BUT! how about some poor guy that wants to buy a Flax and he sees its 500 ea... this is just fucked up... give it a few months with these updates and we gota find a new game to use Scar at but still well thats my thougts... gota go home from school xD cya soon all visit sp0rk-eh!!!! :P:P:P:P

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    even though my thread was posted over an hour before this one.....=\

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    Meh, you can still auto train ur skills, that's the most important thing imho... And get ur macroing accounts money...
    Jagex just seems to want to lose all of their players, legit and non-legit

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    Quote Originally Posted by King of Knives View Post
    As I posted in another thread:
    With all due respect, I think Jagex is destroying the game. For legits aswell as cheaters.

    I'm glad this isn't fully affecting SCAR, since we have more reliable methods than other bots.

    -Knives
    Yea, they just dug their own grave.



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    Well jagex are just dumb and also

    "It could reach a point where macro software becomes undetectable."

    No shit sherlock we are almost there, Jagex need to get a brain and make real macro detection. Firstly it would benefit legit people. Secondly it will give SRL and Scar a challenge to beat there mechanism things, Which is basiclly which is what is on the main page of SRL forums.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Claw View Post
    even though my thread was posted over an hour before this one.....=\
    Yes but Fakawi made this one

    I think this is one of the most idiotic way Jakex could possibly stop the goldselling. They really outdo themselves this time.

    If I get this correct all that they will change is the unbalanced trades ? Such a long news item for that ...
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    no, they have ruined pking as well. and they have ruined being able to sell scripts, unless you want to sell your script for 3k. and they have basically ruined the point of macroing. whats the point in autoing, if your goods cant go anywhere? "levels". yeah, well thats all well and good. if you want to go through every single autoer you have, starting at a bronze sword, sell every feather to get a mith sword, etc etc, on EVERY SINGLE autoer, since you cant have banking account to just trade the gear over now.

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    It will kill most of the bots, except us.. Because we don't auto for real world money.. Ofcourse trading between accounts will be a little harder..

    To be honest, ofcourse this will ruin macroing.. But hey, isn't that smart from runescape? They finally took some serious action..

    We must develop scripts who are way smarter than human.. A single report can be your death..

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    And who wants 8 accounts with good stats tbh what is the point of it.. For me I auto to get money to then sell for real money to then buy membership but I was planning to do all that but instead of buying mems this time was gona buy somethin of ebay cuz I am over RS.


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    well they aint really eliminated drop tradeing 100% soooo i would keep on the bright side of things

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    This is a sad thing for me to hear...

    But I see where Jagex is comming from. They have realized that the battle they have been fighting is useless, and un-winnable, and It is, with bots like RSDemon using lvl 3's how they are.

    This truely is the only way that they can possibly save their game, although it is hurting it quite a bit...

    Makes me sad to see them pushed against the wall so hard...

    I suppose this may tirgger a new era of scar scrips... more skill oriented, much more importance on anti randoms, and less of a multi-character thing...
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    there are riots at all major w's........ join there and spam

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    We are aware that many of you will want to prepare for this change. So, initially, we are just going to make the trade system WARN about unbalanced trades, but it will still allow the trade to go through. This seriously reduces any opportunities for scamming, but still gives you a chance to get used to how it works, organise your items, hand back borrowed stuff, and give Christmas presents. Then, in the first week of January, we will change it to simply not allow unbalanced trades outside of the 3,000gp limit. We will be reminding you when the January date approaches, so that you can be best prepared.

    For certain categories of account (mostly new accounts) we are actually implementing the trade restriction immediately. This allows us to stop a large chunk of the cheating immediately, since most of the real-world traders are using new accounts due to their previous ones being banned. For the vast majority of players, the trade restriction will come into effect in the first week of January.
    You can still trade until the first week of January. Anyone making new accounts now, they are effected.
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