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Thread: The KYAB Issue..

  1. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewToAutoing View Post
    I'm gonna have to quote you as i wish to reply to what you said, but i'll definitely do my best to not flame you

    I'd like it if you could stay on this thread and have a discussion about this as i feel you are one of the people who voices their anti-kyab opinion the most, which in effect would make convincing you a great accomplishment (Though i doubt that's possible anyway xD) and could create for some intellectual debate on the subject.

    Anyway, onto your post. I'm confused. You seem to be contradicting yourself. You say that SRL gives those who aren't the best of the best the ability to make a good script for runescape. And then you say that KYAB makes thing easier. So first you say making things easier is good, but then that it is bad? I realize there are different levels of "easy" but still. Kind of hypocritical.

    Furthermore, anyone can make something similar to KYAB provided they have the knowledge. What i'm getting at is, would you view it as being too easy if you had made KYAB from scratch and then scripts to accompany it? As in, going through the work to make tile walking possible (Which you have to admit, is a more effective approach to walking) for the benefits it gives. To make sure what i'm saying is clear, doing the harder thing of making an add on for the advanced performance it gives. Comparable to choosing to use TPA's to find your objects over a simple FindColor. The former is harder but results in better accuracy, right? Same idea here.

    Only difference is, it's beyond most people's abilities to do something like that, not to mention update it, and it's more effective if everyone uses the same add on, as it creates more compatability. So in the same way that SRL allows "non-gods of programming" to create decent scripts, KYAB allows "non-gods of programming" to create decent scripts with better walking (among other things). Right?

    What i'm getting at is, you seem to feel that KYAB is bad because it takes less work to make a good script, but SRL is the same thing essentially. Plus the whole point of making a script (Or hell, a program in general) is how effective it actually is. Of course the fun is in the challenge, and occasionally the only purpose IS the fun, but if one were to look at the actual performance of it, wouldn't that matter more?

    Maybe you'll disagree with my last point (Hell, i almost do xD) but all in all it seems like you're against improvement. Making something hard easier IS an improvement. Making something more effective IS an improvement. That's why we have cars.

    And if you feel like that takes the fun out of it then i can't honestly see how. It allows you to perfect other aspects of your script, and if everyone is making "perfect scripts" it is much more challenging to make your "perfect script" better than theirs. At least, that's the general feeling i got from the time i spent at RSCA, everyone can make a script that can run for days straight, but making an extremely good and more advanced one (in terms of performance and code quality) was much more rewarding.

    One other point i'd like to mention is that SRL is a learning enviroment, right? We want to help people learn and grow. Why is it then viewed as if "We want to help people learn and grow within the limits of SCAR"? KYAB is open source for a reason, we don't want people to just use it for phr33 g33p33z, it's in the hopes that others will learn from it. Is there anything wrong with that? (Not saying you or anyone else said there is something wrong with that, but you get where i'm going i hope)

    It may be just me but i get the feeling like SRL is against advancements that make SRL or SCAR less useful. That may be another topic altogether, but eh. Anyway, if so, it would make sense as KYAB makes anything related to walking in SRL, unneeded. So that could make sense i suppose, but hopefully that's not the case. If that is the case, i can explain the problems with that later xD

    I realize my post has gotten a bit long and ranty-ish, and probably goes way off from your post JAD, but i'd like to hear what you have to say to the points i provided. And if i have flamed you in anyway, i apologize.

    Edit: Oh, and nobody ever answered my question about why SS uses java (and edits the client) and is 100% accepted while KYAB merely reads variables from the client is not. This question is mainly aimed at those who feel that KYAB is wrong because of it's use of java and whatnot.
    I couldn't respect you more for the mature way you posted that unlike some people who quoted me... Thank you.

    But SRL has been worked on for a long long time, and KYAB takes away a lot from the hard work put into it.

    A different but similiar scenario would be SCAR and Ibot. Why don't we use Ibot over SCAR? Why doesn't Ibot use SCAR over itself (if that makes sense)? One of them is better than the other. If, hypothetically, Ibot was undoubtedly a better bot than SCAR, why aren't we/wouldn't we be using that instead? It's better, right? We could have used RSDemon if that was better too, right? Why didn't/wouldn't we? Maybe it's because we like to script more than we like a better bot/like to leech.

    I don't like KYAB, I never will. There's some people here that don't like KYAB and probably never will either. No matter what we say though, no matter what I say, you say, anybody says: Nobody is going to change the opinions of the people who can make this happen... They've stated their opinions before, and if there opinions had changed, they would have asked about putting KYAB in scar already.

    So it really doesn't matter in any way if you were to convince me, although you probably never will, because I don't have a say in it. You don't have a say in it. Solarwind doesn't have a say in it. Hugo doesn't have a say in it. The admins decided what happened, and it doesn't seem like they've changed their minds because srl is not incorporated with KYAB still.

  2. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAD View Post
    I couldn't respect you more for the mature way you posted that unlike some people who quoted me... Thank you.

    But SRL has been worked on for a long long time, and KYAB takes away a lot from the hard work put into it.

    A different but similiar scenario would be SCAR and Ibot. Why don't we use Ibot over SCAR? Why doesn't Ibot use SCAR over itself (if that makes sense)? One of them is better than the other. If, hypothetically, Ibot was undoubtedly a better bot than SCAR, why aren't we/wouldn't we be using that instead? It's better, right? We could have used RSDemon if that was better too, right? Why didn't/wouldn't we? Maybe it's because we like to script more than we like a better bot/like to leech.

    I don't like KYAB, I never will. There's some people here that don't like KYAB and probably never will either. No matter what we say though, no matter what I say, you say, anybody says: Nobody is going to change the opinions of the people who can make this happen... They've stated their opinions before, and if there opinions had changed, they would have asked about putting KYAB in scar already.

    So it really doesn't matter in any way if you were to convince me, although you probably never will, because I don't have a say in it. You don't have a say in it. Solarwind doesn't have a say in it. Hugo doesn't have a say in it. The admins decided what happened, and it doesn't seem like they've changed their minds because srl is not incorporated with KYAB still.
    I kind of disagree on your last point, everyone has a say on it. One person in particular might not have a large say, but if their opinion is shared by enough people in most cases the admins would consider it and probably change their mind.

    As for why SCAR over RSDemon, that's simple. RSDemon was practically instaban, and was actually harmful to RS. As for why SCAR over iBot, that's more of a matter of opinion i'd say, and it's a bit more difficult to answer.

    And i do think people's opinions can be changed..isn't that the basic purpose of debating or discussing a subject? xD Not that they need to be changed or anything. But honestly, the entire issue of KYAB has become almost as argumentative as that of religion. It was my hope this thread could bring an end to that somewhat.

    Not to mention hardly any admins have posted here (that i can see? o.O) So, if the admins were to post and explain that they felt that way, and that nothing can change their minds, that'd be somewhat different. But as of now most have remained somewhat silent..?

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewToAutoing View Post
    I kind of disagree on your last point, everyone has a say on it. One person in particular might not have a large say, but if their opinion is shared by enough people in most cases the admins would consider it and probably change their mind.

    As for why SCAR over RSDemon, that's simple. RSDemon was practically instaban, and was actually harmful to RS. As for why SCAR over iBot, that's more of a matter of opinion i'd say, and it's a bit more difficult to answer.

    And i do think people's opinions can be changed..isn't that the basic purpose of debating or discussing a subject? xD Not that they need to be changed or anything. But honestly, the entire issue of KYAB has become almost as argumentative as that of religion. It was my hope this thread could bring an end to that somewhat.

    Not to mention hardly any admins have posted here (that i can see? o.O) So, if the admins were to post and explain that they felt that way, and that nothing can change their minds, that'd be somewhat different. But as of now most have remained somewhat silent..?
    It is very unlikely the admins will change their decision even if a large group of people did vote on a subject. Voting is more guidelines of what the members think, not what should be done. If someone made a thread saying "Release source of SCAR", i can 99% guarantee that most people will say yes and the thread will go that way. But does that mean Freddy will do it? no.

    What he was trying to say i think is that we have built SRL up from nothing, just as ruler has ibot and someone else rsdemon. That is why we do not want to abandon them; all of our hard work goes to waste. KYAB makes all of our hard work (our baby if you will) go to waste, which we do not want to see.

    Debating and discussing a matter just gets everyone's views out into the open. I don't think it will change anyone's views on matter, unless they are downright wrong. However. most of the things we discuss have no right or wrong answer.

    Admins don't want to say what they think. If the wanted KYAB integrated hey would have done it. It hasn't happened, therefor we can say they dont want it done. If they post sayin they dont want it done, then they look bad / loose face. Think of it from their point of view.

    As for the whole KYAB = no, SS = yes matter on this board, SS is accepted because we still have to SCAR script and make a good script for it to work; all the challenges of scripting are still there. However with KYAB, most of those challenges are removes, making a large chunk of SRL obsolete. We do not want our baby SRL to go to waste. Plus the whole Solarwind thing, but lets leave that out.

    Just so you know, I like and use KYAB, so don't bash me on anything please, I am just answering a few questions Thanks.

  4. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel.Blaze View Post
    It is very unlikely the admins will change their decision even if a large group of people did vote on a subject. Voting is more guidelines of what the members think, not what should be done. If someone made a thread saying "Release source of SCAR", i can 99% guarantee that most people will say yes and the thread will go that way. But does that mean Freddy will do it? no.

    What he was trying to say i think is that we have built SRL up from nothing, just as ruler has ibot and someone else rsdemon. That is why we do not want to abandon them; all of our hard work goes to waste. KYAB makes all of our hard work (our baby if you will) go to waste, which we do not want to see.

    Debating and discussing a matter just gets everyone's views out into the open. I don't think it will change anyone's views on matter, unless they are downright wrong. However. most of the things we discuss have no right or wrong answer.

    Admins don't want to say what they think. If the wanted KYAB integrated hey would have done it. It hasn't happened, therefor we can say they dont want it done. If they post sayin they dont want it done, then they look bad / loose face. Think of it from their point of view.

    As for the whole KYAB = no, SS = yes matter on this board, SS is accepted because we still have to SCAR script and make a good script for it to work; all the challenges of scripting are still there. However with KYAB, most of those challenges are removes, making a large chunk of SRL obsolete. We do not want our baby SRL to go to waste. Plus the whole Solarwind thing, but lets leave that out.

    Just so you know, I like and use KYAB, so don't bash me on anything please, I am just answering a few questions Thanks.
    Even though daniel likes and uses KYAB, that's pretty much what I've been trying to say this whole time. I pretty much agree 100% on everything he said. Thanks daniel.

    Now I'm done "discussing" this, because we could all discuss it until we're blue in the face, but as dan said, it really wouln't make KYAB integrated into srl.

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    Well I'm sick of being labelled immature simply because you can't find an answer for my valid arguments, so I'll just post something less aggressive. BTW I'm going to quote just so it's easier to reply too

    It is very unlikely the admins will change their decision even if a large group of people did vote on a subject. Voting is more guidelines of what the members think, not what should be done. If someone made a thread saying "Release source of SCAR", i can 99% guarantee that most people will say yes and the thread will go that way. But does that mean Freddy will do it? no.

    What he was trying to say i think is that we have built SRL up from nothing, just as ruler has ibot and someone else rsdemon. That is why we do not want to abandon them; all of our hard work goes to waste. KYAB makes all of our hard work (our baby if you will) go to waste, which we do not want to see.

    Debating and discussing a matter just gets everyone's views out into the open. I don't think it will change anyone's views on matter, unless they are downright wrong. However. most of the things we discuss have no right or wrong answer.

    Admins don't want to say what they think. If the wanted KYAB integrated hey would have done it. It hasn't happened, therefor we can say they dont want it done. If they post sayin they dont want it done, then they look bad / loose face. Think of it from their point of view.

    As for the whole KYAB = no, SS = yes matter on this board, SS is accepted because we still have to SCAR script and make a good script for it to work; all the challenges of scripting are still there. However with KYAB, most of those challenges are removes, making a large chunk of SRL obsolete. We do not want our baby SRL to go to waste. Plus the whole Solarwind thing, but lets leave that out.

    Just so you know, I like and use KYAB, so don't bash me on anything please, I am just answering a few questions Thanks.
    I agree with your first paragraph, the admins won't ever accept KYAB again, but I think the point of this thread, well for me anyway was, why won't it be accepted?

    I also fail too see how KYAB makes all SRL's hard work go to waste seeing as KYAB can't exist without SRL. There are constantly functions being upgraded by people, that replace old SRL functions, yet that does not put all of SRL hard work to waste. KYAB may replace RRW or DDTMS(when used for walking) but it also adds things like getanimation which doesn't replace anything SRL.

    I disagree on your point that SS keeps all of the challenges there. Firstly you do not have to negotiate changing colours and picking up colours from other objects you do not want. A lot of the time you had to find ways other than findcolortol to find an object but with SS you could just do a findcolor without even a tolerance and you'd find your object 100% of the time. Also one of walkings main challenges was to get the whole walk working even with a changing compass, SS disables the changing compass.

    I think your arguments were a lot more stronger than the previous ones thrown out and at least you gave an answer about the SS thing unlike everyone else avoiding the questions. You made some valid points too.

    keep posting

    -RK
    Sleeping...

  6. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkroxpunk View Post
    Well I'm sick of being labelled immature simply because you can't find an answer for my valid arguments, so I'll just post something less aggressive. BTW I'm going to quote just so it's easier to reply too



    I agree with your first paragraph, the admins won't ever accept KYAB again, but I think the point of this thread, well for me anyway was, why won't it be accepted?

    I also fail too see how KYAB makes all SRL's hard work go to waste seeing as KYAB can't exist without SRL. There are constantly functions being upgraded by people, that replace old SRL functions, yet that does not put all of SRL hard work to waste. KYAB may replace RRW or DDTMS(when used for walking) but it also adds things like getanimation which doesn't replace anything SRL.

    I disagree on your point that SS keeps all of the challenges there. Firstly you do not have to negotiate changing colours and picking up colours from other objects you do not want. A lot of the time you had to find ways other than findcolortol to find an object but with SS you could just do a findcolor without even a tolerance and you'd find your object 100% of the time. Also one of walkings main challenges was to get the whole walk working even with a changing compass, SS disables the changing compass.

    I think your arguments were a lot more stronger than the previous ones thrown out and at least you gave an answer about the SS thing unlike everyone else avoiding the questions. You made some valid points too.

    keep posting

    -RK
    Thanks i appreciate your maturity.

    The admins won't accept KYAB because most of them are the people who have put the most effort into making SRL: Fakawi, Wizzup, Benland, Sumilion, Starblaster100, Flyboy etc. All of them have put a huge amount of effort into making SRL what it is today. I don't blame them, SRL is amazing

    KYAB can exist without SRL, they just have to make their own include and it will be done. KYAB doesn't depend on SRL, they choose to make it depend on SRL. SRL obviously doesn't depend on KYAB either. The only reason KYAB is depending on SRL is because the admins of KYAB have chosen to do so, as this is a powerful community and they want to be high up in it.

    SS does eliminate some challenges yes, but not all of them. Walking is still hard to do, as well as finding all objects, interacting with objects etc. with KYAB, you just have to say Interact with this ID, wait for this motion, click this tile. It makes it too easy, and can also make a script detectable. With SS, only the less experienced scripters will say click coord here, they will still use SRL failsafes. Also, in SS wasn't map locked north taken out at one point? Don't know if this is still the case.

    KYAB just makes things too simple, SS just eliminates a couple of challenges for a few people IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel.Blaze View Post
    Thanks i appreciate your maturity.

    The admins won't accept KYAB because most of them are the people who have put the most effort into making SRL: Fakawi, Wizzup, Benland, Sumilion, Starblaster100, Flyboy etc. All of them have put a huge amount of effort into making SRL what it is today. I don't blame them, SRL is amazing

    KYAB can exist without SRL, they just have to make their own include and it will be done. KYAB doesn't depend on SRL, they choose to make it depend on SRL. SRL obviously doesn't depend on KYAB either. The only reason KYAB is depending on SRL is because the admins of KYAB have chosen to do so, as this is a powerful community and they want to be high up in it.

    SS does eliminate some challenges yes, but not all of them. Walking is still hard to do, as well as finding all objects, interacting with objects etc. with KYAB, you just have to say Interact with this ID, wait for this motion, click this tile. It makes it too easy, and can also make a script detectable. With SS, only the less experienced scripters will say click coord here, they will still use SRL failsafes. Also, in SS wasn't map locked north taken out at one point? Don't know if this is still the case.

    KYAB just makes things too simple, SS just eliminates a couple of challenges for a few people IMO.
    I kinda agree with your first point but you must realise, pretty much the only other thing KYAB has atm is walking, getanimation/motion. To write a whole new include like SRL would be as you said, a mammoth job, but you're right in that KYAB could make its own include.

    Ok what I am about to say is a rip off of Icefire's exceptional point. Its about the whole "KYAB is too simple" thing. I'll just quote him.

    Originally Posted by IceFire
    anyways... one of my key points is something to do along the lines of the "the lack of complexity in the coding" this is just simply a completely over exaggerated term used by people.

    I have even seen some people post things that mock KYAB as simple as:
    Code:
    begin
      repeat
        MineCoalAtVarrock;
      until (False);
    end.
    Just to show you exactly how misleading this is, I would like to show you code from my script being made (Rune Crafter ReBorn).

    Below is a banking function designed to open any bank I need for the script (using strictly SRL coding):
    Code:
    {*******************************************************************************
    function OpenBankIce: Boolean;
    By: IceFire908.
    Description: Opens any bank needed for RCrB.
    *******************************************************************************}
    
    function OpenBankIce: Boolean;
    var
      BankInfo: TIntegerArray;
      OB, TPA: TPointArray;
      I, T: LongInt;
      Bank: string;
    begin
      if (not (LoggedIn)) then
        Exit;
      Bank := Between('(', ')', Players[CurrentPlayer].Strings[1]);
      Randoms;
      WriteLn('Opening ' + Bank + '...');
      case Bank of
        'FEB': BankInfo := [220, 260, 4612728, 14];
        'FWB': BankInfo := [300, 300, 4612728, 14];
        'DB': BankInfo := [175, 145, 605006, 4];
        'AKB': BankInfo := [130, 180, 606291, 4];
        'VEB': BankInfo := [200, 290, 2971236, 10];
        'EB': BankInfo := [290, 190, 606551, 4]
      end;
      FindColorsSpiralTolerance(BankInfo[0], BankInfo[1], OB, BankInfo[2], MSX1, MSY1, MSX2, MSY2, BankInfo[3]);
      SetArrayLength(TPA, 0);
      TPA := OB;
      SetArrayLength(OB, 0);
      OB := ReArrangeAndShortenArray(TPA, 14);
      for I := 0 to (GetArrayLength(OB) - 1) do
      begin
        MMouse(OB[I].X, OB[I].Y, 1, 1);
        Wait(200 + Random(50));
        if (IsUpText('ooth')) then
        begin
          GetMousePos(OB[I].X, OB[I].Y);
          Mouse(OB[I].X, OB[I].Y, 0, 0, False);
          Wait(200 + Random(50));
          ChooseOption('uickly');
          FFlag(0);
          T := GetSystemTime;
          repeat
            Wait(100 + Random(50));
            if (BankScreen) then
            begin
              Result := True;
              Break;
            end;
            if (PinScreen) then
            begin
              InPin(Players[CurrentPlayer].Strings[0]);
              Wait(500 + Random(200));
            end;
          until ((GetSystemTime - T) >  6000);
          if (Result) then
          begin
            WriteLn('Opened ' + Bank + '.');
            Players[CurrentPlayer].Banked := Players[CurrentPlayer].Banked + 1;
            TotalScript[10] := TotalScript[10] + 1;
            WriteINI('TotalScript', '10', IntToStr(TotalScript[10]), ScriptPath + 'ScriptSettings.INI');
            Total[9] := Total[9] + 1;
            FixBank;
            Exit;
          end;
        end;
      end;
      WriteLn('Failed to open ' + Bank + ', logging out.');
      LogOut;
    end;
    And here is an example of a chunk of code that was in RCrB V1.01 with the help of KYAB former features 'Types and UIDs'

    Code:
    {*******************************************************************************
    function OpenFEB: Boolean;
    By: IceFire908.
    Description: Opens Fallador East Bank.
    *******************************************************************************}
    
    function OpenFEB: Boolean;
    var
      FEBBoothFindingTime: Integer;
      OFEB: TPoint;
    begin
      if (not (LoggedIn)) then Exit;
      FastRandoms;
      Status('Opening Fallador East Bank...');
      WriteLn('Opening Fallador East Bank...');
      MarkTime(FEBBoothFindingTime);
      repeat
        MSCoordsOfUID(FindClosestObject(11758), 5, OFEB.X, OFEB.Y);
        MMouse(OFEB.X, OFEB.Y, 4, 4);
        Wait(300 + Random(250));
        if (IsUpTextMulti('e Bank', 'Booth', 'ooth')) then
        begin
          GetMousePos(OFEB.X, OFEB.Y);
          Mouse(OFEB.X, OFEB.Y, 0, 0, False);
          Wait(300 + Random(250));
          ChooseOptionEx('uickly');
          DontBan;
          FFlag(0);
          Wait(300 + Random(250));
          if (PinScreen) then InPin(Players[CurrentPlayer].String1);
          Wait(500 + Random(200));
        end;
        if ((TimeFromMark(FEBBoothFindingTime) > (15000 - Random(1000))) and (not (BankScreen))) then
        begin
          WriteLn('Failed to open Fallador East Bank, logging out.');
          LogOut;
          Exit;
        end;
        Wait(1500 + Random(250));
      until (BankScreen)
      Result := True;
      WriteLn('Opened Fallador East Bank.');
      Status('Finished opening Fallador East Bank.');
      Players[CurrentPlayer].Banked := Players[CurrentPlayer].Banked + 1;
      TotalScriptBANKS := TotalScriptBANKS + 1;
      SaveSetting('IceFiresRuneCrafter', 'TotalScriptBANKS', IntToStr(TotalScriptBANKS));
      Banks := Banks + 1;
      FixBank;
      DontBan;
    end;
    Complexity difference is barely anything. Just because KYAB finds the object easier I think that people automatically assume the code is easier. Well I think Ice put that to rest.
    Sleeping...

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    Quote Originally Posted by rkroxpunk View Post
    I kinda agree with your first point but you must realise, pretty much the only other thing KYAB has atm is walking, getanimation/motion. To write a whole new include like SRL would be as you said, a mammoth job, but you're right in that KYAB could make its own include.

    Ok what I am about to say is a rip off of Icefire's exceptional point. Its about the whole "KYAB is too simple" thing. I'll just quote him.


    Complexity difference is barely anything. Just because KYAB finds the object easier I think that people automatically assume the code is easier. Well I think Ice put that to rest.
    IceFire's Craft is 6000 + lines and that is USING KYAB so I think KYAB doesn't make things that easy at all, and no KYAB does depend on SRL, we are a dying community and most likely die if we do not unite with SRL.

    I'm sure the admins would post if they were active, Fakawi would post here I'm sure and Wizzy has posted.
    The only thnig they would both post or have posted is that it's still "using our knowledge of the java code" that is the lamest excuse ever IMO they could have found a much better excuse not throw that bs at us but meh it's besides the point KYAB will live on hopefully.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rkroxpunk View Post
    Well I'm sick of being labelled immature simply I agree with your first paragraph, the admins won't ever accept KYAB again, but I think the point of this thread, well for me anyway was, why won't it be accepted?
    That's the point of this thread for me too Oh and you're not immature xD

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugolord View Post
    IceFire's Craft is 6000 + lines and that is USING KYAB so I think KYAB doesn't make things that easy at all, and no KYAB does depend on SRL, we are a dying community and most likely die if we do not unite with SRL.

    I'm sure the admins would post if they were active, Fakawi would post here I'm sure and Wizzy has posted.
    The only thnig they would both post or have posted is that it's still "using our knowledge of the java code" that is the lamest excuse ever IMO they could have found a much better excuse not throw that bs at us but meh it's besides the point KYAB will live on hopefully.
    KYAB is a dieing community for the simple reason that no one is doing anything there. Even with xKYAB, the only people who ever really did anything on it were imafatmess and joey. And imafatmess was the one who got things going, so to speak. Now that he's stopped worked on it all work has pretty much halted. I don't think that the reason we should "unite with SRL" is to keep the KYAB community alive, that's stupid. But i do think that the communities should become more friendly towards eachother at the least, as that can only be beneficial to both. And as far as the using java code, that argument hasn't once been brought up here because fit makes no sense considering SS

    But yeah, IceFire's script is/was a great example that complexity and the challenge remain when you use KYAB. Only problem with the code examples posted is that the non-KYAB version was made to work for any bank and the KYAB version for only FEB, making it look less complex xD

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    Just to say something, using WalkToTile is more complex to use than Radialwalking; no offense to any direction...

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    Sure, but making a radialwalk make sence and actually work stable is way harder then using WalkToTile....
    Infractions, reputation, reflection, the dark side of scripting, they are.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerdou View Post
    Sure, but making a radialwalk make sence and actually work stable is way harder then using WalkToTile....
    correct, but, as you see IceFire script was over 6000 lines long, while he quickly did the walking he focused on more important things and made quite a complex script.. whereas if you used scar anyone can do walking in scar too it just takes longer and then you won't have as much time to focus on other things..

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    Quote Originally Posted by rkroxpunk View Post
    I think your arguments were a lot more stronger than the previous ones thrown out and at least you gave an answer about the SS thing unlike everyone else avoiding the questions. You made some valid points too.

    -RK
    Do you think it's right to answer a question youj don't have enough knowledge on? I've never used scar scape, and I don't think I had even heard of it until a few weeks ago. You would have bashed me if I answered your question because I would have sounded like I had no knowledge on SS, which I really don't.

    You wouldn't talk about how you hate the way SCAR's source code looks (example), would you? Because you, or not anybody else really except freddy, has any idea.

    And even if I did have the knowledge on it, we have the right to speak and not to speak on these forums. You don't need to speak about how you voted on a members app or anything. It's a privilege, and it doesn't in any way need to be used.


    I'm done posting on this topic unless somebody asks me a valid question I feel like responding too. This thread is going nowhere because from what I've seen and heard, nothing has changed since last time.



    Edit: and for the record:

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugolord View Post
    correct, but, as you see IceFire script was over 6000 lines long, while he quickly did the walking he focused on more important things and made quite a complex script.. whereas if you used scar anyone can do walking in scar too it just takes longer and then you won't have as much time to focus on other things..
    a script that's 6000 lines long could have taken a shorter amount of time to script than a script 500 lines long, and the 500 line long script might still work better, not saying that's the case with his script. Length doesn't mean anything. There's been power miners probably longer than Wizzup?'s that didn't work as well.

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    Just budding into this thread real quick.

    I did not intent for that quote to be posted on these forums just yet, however I will say a few things regarding it.

    My main purpose of posting that chunk of code is to show my actual first hand experience in coding in both SRL and KYAB. As you can tell the SRL was only slightly more complex to code (that and because it was designed for 6 banks instead of 1 mind me). The fact that my RuneCrafter was 6616 lines of code isn't necessarily what makes it "complex" or whatever, it's the way the loops are designed and the integration of SRL functions working with KYAB's functions to time the script just so perfectly and add fail safes using the same good old methods the only difference is the way the X, Y of the bankbooth are found. One uses a line that uses FindColorsSpiral, and one uses a line that uses FindMSCoordsOfUID.

    Now, I ask you, with a difference as small as that is it really fair to say something like "KYAB should never be used here" The thing this, no one has ever or will ever force you to use KYAB, simply if you don't want to use KYAB you don't have to and from what I can think of the only reasons to keep other people from using KYAB are stupid things like feeling special because you confused some people with your code, in other words, you would rather be appreciated by others for something you did yet you claim it's only for the intellectual challenge of scripting when really, there's more to it than that.

    I will leave this thread again for now after saying something...

    If you really want to accomplish something here, stop defending a single point of view (this applys to both opinions Pro and Anti-KYAB) because you will never get very far just from that. You have to carefully consider everything you read and come to the closest good decision whether it's for KYAB or against it and whether you have to keep or change your previous opinion.

    Play nice,

    -IceFire

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    (hopefully) last thing I have to say.

    Why do you want KYAB integrated into srl? Because it would be more popular? KYAB right now you "don't have to use" if you don't want to, but you can if you do. The only reason I can see for you wanting it integrated into srl is because it would be more widely used because this is the biggest forum for runescape autoing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAD View Post
    (hopefully) last thing I have to say.

    Why do you want KYAB integrated into srl? Because it would be more popular? KYAB right now you "don't have to use" if you don't want to, but you can if you do. The only reason I can see for you wanting it integrated into srl is because it would be more widely used because this is the biggest forum for runescape autoing.
    Where did I say anything about integrating it into SRL?

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    I was wondering why in KYAB whenever i visit the site, i get this: Sorry guest, you a banned from using this forum! Banned.

    I have never even been there before so i was wondering why it says this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IceFire908 View Post
    Where did I say anything about integrating it into SRL?
    I didn't quote you...

    But IDK why, I thought this topic was about integrating it into srl. Thought somebody said something about that... Probably wrong though.


    What, in the perfect world, do you want to happen between srl and KYAB?? The admins to say we accept and use KYAB? What would that do, and what does it mean to you?

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    From Hobbit. I text him back and forth over cell. Been keeping him from going insane without SRL.

    When KYAB went public Fakawi didn't want it as part of SRL, he didn't from the beginning. Now that he is gone for awhile, you try to bring it back? Kyab is separate from SRL and should remain as such. KYAB has its own site, if you are trying to get it in to SRL cause KYAB is dieing or you don't want to pay the bills...Well I'm sorry but thats your problem not ours. If KYAB dies, so be it. No offense but as soon as I saw that email about the reported post by solar I knew something like this was about to happen. Lets face the facts, solar you only come around when you want something.
    That is what Hobbit said yesterday. He hasn't read the topic at all, just what it says in the First post and knows what this topic is about. I am trying to get him more info. But it is hard to text mass amounts with a cell.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rubix View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Cardin View Post
    you ought to listen to Mr. Klean...he's magical!
    this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.klean View Post
    From Hobbit. I text him back and forth over cell. Been keeping him from going insane without SRL.

    That is what Hobbit said yesterday. He hasn't read the topic at all, just what it says in the First post and knows what this topic is about. I am trying to get him more info. But it is hard to text mass amounts with a cell.
    I find this very interesting. I don't think that (no offence to any side) that KYAB should be integrated into SRL. I think that two communities shouldn't fight, though. I understand when you make a piece of work, you want it to be admired. I do admire it. I could never make something this awesome with java. I can't do much on it. I hope that these two communities can get along.

    Cut em2 it
    Formerly known as Cut em2 it

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    SCAR Code:
    Function LoadPath(PathType: String): TPointArray;

    Begin
      Case PathType Of
      'ToMonk':
        Result := [Point(3092, 3243), Point(3084, 3249), Point(3078, 3255),
        Point(3072, 3261), Point(3072, 3269), Point(3066, 3269),
        Point(3065, 3262), Point(3060, 3253), Point(3051, 3248),
        Point(3042, 3242), Point(3048, 3236)];
      'InsideAltar':
        Result := [Point(2464, 4819), Point(2464, 4830)];
      'LogToAltar':
        Result := [Point(2834, 3335), Point(2845, 3335), Point(2855, 3340),
        Point(2859, 3346), Point(2858, 3356), Point(2857, 3367), Point(2858, 3379)];
      'ToBank':
        Result := [Point(3105, 3251), Point(3097, 3249), Point(3092, 3244)];
      End;
    End;

    Normally walking from draynor to the law altar would take me more time and lines, no?

    I bet the actual path\walking part of an everywhere crafter with TileWalking should take no longer than 200 lines.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugolord View Post
    IceFire's Craft is 6000 + lines and that is USING KYAB so I think KYAB doesn't make things that easy at all, and no KYAB does depend on SRL, we are a dying community and most likely die if we do not unite with SRL.

    I'm sure the admins would post if they were active, Fakawi would post here I'm sure and Wizzy has posted.
    The only thnig they would both post or have posted is that it's still "using our knowledge of the java code" that is the lamest excuse ever IMO they could have found a much better excuse not throw that bs at us but meh it's besides the point KYAB will live on hopefully.
    To be honest, you are the one throwing 'bullshit' at everyone here.

    You come here advertising KYAB, without solarwind even knowing of it in the first place.
    Maybe you should ask him for a word of advice and permission.
    After all, if this thread causes problems, most people will blame him instead of you.
    You know how alot of people at SRL think about KYAB, why would you repost a thread that has caused for problems every time it got posted...?

    Come up with good arguments instead of starting fights with everyone around here.

    Maybe you should talk to solarwind, he seems alot more mature now.

    Oh yeah, and don't start accusing the admins of using lame arguments, will you?

    ~ Wizzup?



    The best way to contact me is by email, which you can find on my website: http://wizzup.org
    I also get email notifications of private messages, though.

    Simba (on Twitter | Group on Villavu | Website | Stable/Unstable releases
    Documentation | Source | Simba Bug Tracker on Github and Villavu )


    My (Blog | Website)

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    After seeying Wizzup? example i can only say "WOW", i mean that's all there is to it? And it's 100% accurate? Geez, i just finished creating the DDTM's for a junglewalk for my nature runecrafter, which added 1500+ lines extra to the script. After it's finished i plan on trying out KYAB, and post it on your boards for sure, that way i can make up my own mind about the whole "issue"

    Someone on this thread said something about not being against progress, I agree with that, to the point that you don't start relying on the progress. I don't know how easy it is to update KYAB, SRL seems allot easier depending on the update offcourse.
    I heard that in the beginning of KYAB it was down every 5 minutes or so, course, i'm sure those where just symtoms of a new system being created. But it does relate back to the relying on progress issue for me.

    If KYAB gets integrated with SRL then after a while everyone will use it for sure, even the ones claiming they want the challenge, cause we are all human and we want the easy way, those disagreeing with me don't know themself that well or are to pigheaded to admit it.
    Course, with the KYAB part being so flawless and being used all the time, there is no need for the other walking procedures in SRL. So after a while they'll be taken out, cause what dev is gone spend time on updating a procedure that nobody uses? Which makes us scripters rely on KYAB to do the walking, nothing wrong with that, unless at some point for some reason KYAB goes down, and please don't say it's not possible cause it is, just like SRL can go down also, just think it's easier for KYAB and might be harder to fix then with SRL?
    Basically, what i'm trying to point out is, integrating KYAB in SRL is progress and progress is a good thing for sure. Depending on how it's used, we could end up castrating ourself.

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    The way i see it is, if you want to use kyab with srl go a head! if you dont dont , since the admins do not want to merge it dont press it because you want to use ot to script do it dont if you dont it doest have to to be merged together to make it able to use , so there is not point making this thread if you can use it anyway you want more people on kyab? just ask them via massager , they dot have you "unite" if the admins dont what to do it ( as i can see Wizzup? doesnt want to) if you want to use kyab with srl go head not need to make it all one site they are 2 different types of scripting used together so lets just keep it 2 different sites

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    /me enters pissing contest
    Code:
        //Walks to nearest bank deposits everything
        theBank.doDepositAll();
        //Walks to some place in Lumbridge from anywhere
        theWorldMap.walkTo(new AryanTile(3221, 3248));
    SMART, SS are both Java Bots.


    KYAB is not here for the same reasons UBI was not here, politics.

    This is where KYAB should go in the stack:
    SCAR -> SRL - > SMART - > KYAB
    www.rscheata.net
    Home of iBot on neXus: a multi-client, minimizable, Hyrid, Color, Reflection, scriptable, multi-threaded Java Bot.

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    ^ hooray for politics, TBH I don't know what the purpose of this thread was buuuut, another purpose for this thread for me is, why was it taken out of SRL. It's obviously never going to be integrated again but I just find it hypocritical to be taken out of SRL for the use of Java code when SMART and SS are perfectly acceptable.

    @JAD I must say your last post quoting me made a valid point in the sense that you shouldn't post about things you don't know about, my bad :S
    Sleeping...

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