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Thread: Fixing the Economy

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    Most of us on this forum are just kids, and although I don't live in the US, the "economic crisis" hasn't affected my life in a single way yet, any channel's news you can hear from that the economic crisis will get worse etc, but seriously... Could someone give an example of how it has affected their lives yet? One thing I can think of is getting a job or selling a house is harder... Or getting loan

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    Fascism is a totalitarian state, meaning the government controls everything aka socialism. Granted, socialism is just buisnesses, but after that how much is really left?
    What what what? I suppose if the only single thing you live for is money, then you can consider yourself powerless in a socialist system.
    The problem is people thing socialism = fascism = communism = Hitler.

    When you get to either extreme of the political spectrum, you start to see things in common again. In fact, it's closer to a circle than a line, see http://members.cox.net/jayc1832/The%...l%20Circle.jpg . Notice how (European) socialists are on the opposite side of fascists

    I don't think Obama will get as much done as people expect of him, but there's only so much that can be done by a single person. In my opinion, the hard part will be to make people start spending money on random things again.

    Quote Originally Posted by n3ss3s View Post
    Could someone give an example of how it has affected their lives yet? One thing I can think of is getting a job or selling a house is harder... Or getting loan
    So far gas has gotten cheaper, and quite a few people have lost their jobs and/or homes. Both my parents work jobs where they basically can't be fired, so I'm on the lucky side.

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    So far gas has gotten cheaper, and quite a few people have lost their jobs and/or homes. Both my parents work jobs where they basically can't be fired, so I'm on the lucky side.
    True, but still I find it somehow stupid to have a conversation about whether or not Obama is able to do something about it, should rather discuss what will he do about it, what could he or what has he done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by n3ss3s View Post
    True, but still I find it somehow stupid to have a conversation about whether or not Obama is able to do something about it, should rather discuss what will he do about it, what could he or what has he done.
    hello,

    I wasnt saying that Obama wont do anything, It is obvious that he will act and do something about the economic problems. But, I was simply randomly asking/commenting on whether or not what he does will succeed. It would be better however to ask what he will do or has done. Sounds better. Good comment. :-0

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    Quote Originally Posted by n3ss3s View Post
    Most of us on this forum are just kids, and although I don't live in the US, the "economic crisis" hasn't affected my life in a single way yet, any channel's news you can hear from that the economic crisis will get worse etc, but seriously... Could someone give an example of how it has affected their lives yet? One thing I can think of is getting a job or selling a house is harder... Or getting loan
    The problem is the decisions they will make now will effect us 20 years down the road and will give us problems then. That is why politics is important.

    Quote Originally Posted by Widget View Post
    What what what? I suppose if the only single thing you live for is money, then you can consider yourself powerless in a socialist system.
    The problem is people thing socialism = fascism = communism = Hitler.

    When you get to either extreme of the political spectrum, you start to see things in common again. In fact, it's closer to a circle than a line, see http://members.cox.net/jayc1832/The%...l%20Circle.jpg . Notice how (European) socialists are on the opposite side of fascists
    Communism doesnt = Hitler >_> Hitler was a Fascist it is very well known. the thing is that Fascism=Socialism+Racism/Segragation...

    Quote Originally Posted by Widget View Post
    I don't think Obama will get as much done as people expect of him, but there's only so much that can be done by a single person. In my opinion, the hard part will be to make people start spending money on random things again.
    The problem is he isnt trying to get people to spend money on things, he is getting the government to spend money.

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    One thing i hate is some people that make threads or forums up syaing that obama is not from Amercia and stuff? Well? WHO CARE|S?? lol he going to do a great job and he's the frist amercian black pers
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    Quote Originally Posted by mazo1 View Post
    One thing i hate is some people that make threads or forums up syaing that obama is not from Amercia and stuff? Well? WHO CARE|S?? lol he going to do a great job and he's the frist amercian black pers
    Its actually true he is not a native citizen of the United States. Him doing a "great job" as the president is a matter of opinion. Personally i think he is either an idiot or playing us all for chumps. If he believes in what he says he has to be the biggest fool in the world, on the other hand if he doesnt believe in what he says (which is most likely) then he is a very smart man... Either way he is not doing a good job in my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    Its actually true he is not a native citizen of the United States. Him doing a "great job" as the president is a matter of opinion. Personally i think he is either an idiot or playing us all for chumps. If he believes in what he says he has to be the biggest fool in the world, on the other hand if he doesnt believe in what he says (which is most likely) then he is a very smart man... Either way he is not doing a good job in my opinion.
    Ya I don't think he believes in what he said, because he has already come out and said that he won't be able to do some of the things that he promised during his campaign(everyone does that). I believe that the best president would be one who did the least, because most of what presidents do that is remembered goes against their constitutional powers(Lincoln, Roosevelt, etc...).

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    I see well still i think he will do a great job
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    Quote Originally Posted by mormonman View Post
    Ya I don't think he believes in what he said, because he has already come out and said that he won't be able to do some of the things that he promised during his campaign(everyone does that). I believe that the best president would be one who did the least, because most of what presidents do that is remembered goes against their constitutional powers(Lincoln, Roosevelt, etc...).
    I dont know how Lincoln or Roosevelt went against their constitutional powers. The Constitution grants them power to be the leader of the military, and until the war powers act of (197?) they could send the military to any location for any amount of time to do whatever they wanted.

    Has anyone else thought of WHY Obama wants Republicans to vote for the "Stimulous Package"? In case you dont know Obama could get the bill passed without a single Republican.
    I believe it is because Obama wants to :
    1. Win in the PR department as being "Bi-Partisan"
    2. When it doesnt work then not all the blame will be put on Democrats

    You might be thinking (if you actually read this post), "Why would Obama want to do something that he doesn't think will work". Simple, Ensuring power for Democrats for years to come. The "Stimulous Package" will actually put a lot of people on the government dole. They are increasing the amount of money that goes to food stamps, Social Security, and unemployment benefits. It is pretty well known that the vast majority of people who are living off the government vote Democrat, as they are the ones who promise all the social programs. So if he can successfully put people on the dole, it will make the Democrats remain in power for a long time. However if very few if any Republicans vote for it will be met with strong public criticism. Which will give the Republicans a chance in 2010 to win some Senate/HoR seats.

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    Quote Originally Posted by n3ss3s View Post
    Most of us on this forum are just kids, and although I don't live in the US, the "economic crisis" hasn't affected my life in a single way yet, any channel's news you can hear from that the economic crisis will get worse etc, but seriously... Could someone give an example of how it has affected their lives yet? One thing I can think of is getting a job or selling a house is harder... Or getting loan
    actually... its a different story for me.

    Thanks to this Economic crisis, I havent been able to find a decent job (one that pays minimum wage) where I live. Older people get priority over me. (CAN YOU BELIEVE THAT!?!?) Reports about lesser students getting into College is also going around and it shows at my University. My college alone has started to limit applications from 2000 new apps to 800 new apps every year because of this economic problem and it doesnt seem to be going away anytime soon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    Every buisness in the US started small and worked its way up with someone who poured his/her time and effort into it.
    Ahh... so this is saying that when ill-conceived bailout programs are drafted and passed --> that would be socialism?.... When the government starts to monopolize then something has gone wrong. I can say this because they are keeping businesses from failing. If a corrupt and broken system does not fail, then new and improved ideas will never be able to flourish..... What we (as many nations (but mostly certain lazy Americans in my opinion)) lack is the good`ol hard work. Honest time put into something. I am in no way saying that there is not effort put into anything these days; I am saying that many people have found ways to do virtually nothing and live off of other people (say... you and me) through the government (abuse of a great idea to help those who TRULY need the assistance).

    Quote Originally Posted by mormonman View Post
    I believe that the best president would be one who did the least, because most of what presidents do that is remembered goes against their constitutional powers(Lincoln, Roosevelt, etc...).
    Hm now.... I disagree with that. James Knox Polk, the eleventh president, came out "riding on a dark horse" and told the people what he wanted to accomplish and how long it would take. He kept to his word. Adding territory that now composes the states of Arizona, Utah, Nevada, California, Oregon, Idaho, Washington, much of New Mexico, and portions of Wyoming, Montana, and Colorado, James Knox Polk truly did not just sit back and do noting. Also to his word, he did this in one term (and did not run for a second one (although he would have easily won)). --> not exactly what you are talking about... but still makes a good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    You might be thinking (if you actually read this post), "Why would Obama want to do something that he doesn't think will work". Simple, Ensuring power for Democrats for years to come. The "Stimulous Package" will actually put a lot of people on the government dole. They are increasing the amount of money that goes to food stamps, Social Security, and unemployment benefits. It is pretty well known that the vast majority of people who are living off the government vote Democrat, as they are the ones who promise all the social programs. So if he can successfully put people on the dole, it will make the Democrats remain in power for a long time. However if very few if any Republicans vote for it will be met with strong public criticism. Which will give the Republicans a chance in 2010 to win some Senate/HoR seats.
    YES, he is trying to bring together the whole nation. That way if one part fails, a finger will not be pointed and create complete collapse. What we need is a President that is willing to tell the truth (crazy, I know). In my opinion, I would rather have a President come out and say, "we have just entered a time of nationwide recession and crisis. I cannot make you any promises about the outcome, but I can promise you that as a citizen of this country that I love dearly I will do my best and all that is in my power to get us through this. To do just that, our nation will need unity and strength. We will need spirit and hope. We will need the dedication of all our people to work not only for themselves but for each other. We need a United States."
    ..... I am not saying there needs to be a whole moving and emotional speech, I am just saying that I would rather have someone who would say that they messed up... that they will keep doing there best.... that they have a way out but it will take the faith and perseverance of us all...

    I may or may not be overjoyed that Obama made it into the Presidency, but I will do my best to fill my part/role in this nation. I will support the President when he needs the support and I will speak out if/when the nation has been wronged/hurt. I trust that he will do what he feels/knows is necessary. I may not always agree, but I will do my best to support when the time arises.

    People may blame the leaders. People may disagree. What the United States needs is a leader who can lead and people who can follow. No, No, No.... not mindless drones ... but people with a desire to better the nation and expand the economy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anonymity View Post
    YES, he is trying to bring together the whole nation. That way if one part fails, a finger will not be pointed and create complete collapse. What we need is a President that is willing to tell the truth (crazy, I know). In my opinion, I would rather have a President come out and say, "we have just entered a time of nationwide recession and crisis. I cannot make you any promises about the outcome, but I can promise you that as a citizen of this country that I love dearly I will do my best and all that is in my power to get us through this. To do just that, our nation will need unity and strength. We will need spirit and hope. We will need the dedication of all our people to work not only for themselves but for each other. We need a United States."
    ..... I am not saying there needs to be a whole moving and emotional speech, I am just saying that I would rather have someone who would say that they messed up... that they will keep doing there best.... that they have a way out but it will take the faith and perseverance of us all...

    I may or may not be overjoyed that Obama made it into the Presidency, but I will do my best to fill my part/role in this nation. I will support the President when he needs the support and I will speak out if/when the nation has been wronged/hurt. I trust that he will do what he feels/knows is necessary. I may not always agree, but I will do my best to support when the time arises.

    People may blame the leaders. People may disagree. What the United States needs is a leader who can lead and people who can follow. No, No, No.... not mindless drones ... but people with a desire to better the nation and expand the economy.
    Of course but you have to have a mind of your own because you will need to know what will effect your life. Anyway, I will break down what a lot of the "economic stimulous package" money is going to.

    20 Billion to food stamps (More on the dole)
    18.5 Billion for Energy efficiency/renewable energy programs (Not entirely bad but a lot of money for research ect)
    20.4 Billion for Department of Health and Human services (Aka Social Security)
    20 Billion to Rennovate Elementary/Secondary schools (Will help some for construction, but it is once more throwing more money at the education system)
    17.6 Billion for Pell grants/other financial assistance for education (Wont directly help the economy)
    29.1 Billion for other elementary/secondary school programs
    30 Billion for Highway construction (Will actually do SOME good for the temporary)
    13.1 Billion for other transportation programs
    11.2 Billion for Housing assistance by HUD(Getting more people on the gov dole)
    19.5 Billion minimum for education grants
    27.1 Billion to increase unemployment benefits (Getting more people on the dole)
    13.3 Billion for health insurance to unemployed workers (Yay more people on the dole)
    11.1 Billion for "Other Unemployment Compensation"(Yet more people on the dole)
    20.2 Billion for Medicaid and Medicare incentive payments (Some more people on the dole)

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    I agree (for the most part) with the "economic stimulus package." I do not agree with sheer bailouts. I do not agree with the abuse (from the people) of certain programs in the "economic stimulus package."...... and thanks for posting those stats. That gives a few people the chance to see what they may be talking about.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anonymity View Post
    I agree (for the most part) with the "economic stimulus package." I do not agree with sheer bailouts. I do not agree with the abuse (from the people) of certain programs in the "economic stimulus package."...... and thanks for posting those stats. That gives a few people the chance to see what they may be talking about.
    The thing is Obama talks about us "needing action now". I got those figures from a National Review economist (one of my teachers gave it to me, so i dont have a link). But in that paper it shows how making tax cuts gets the people more money,quicker, than the government spending money, and in the long run your children arent paying for it.

    The best way to give someone money (as per the government) is to not take it at all.

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    Well today one of my mates told me that Obama is planing to like get all the troops out of iraq because like he thinks that his terriost crap will stop when ever the US leave there country well mostly afganstain but i think that's quite true the only reason there are terriosts is coz amercia's like in their country or UK anyone with me
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    Quote Originally Posted by mazo1 View Post
    Well today one of my mates told me that Obama is planing to like get all the troops out of iraq because like he thinks that his terriost crap will stop when ever the US leave there country well mostly afganstain but i think that's quite true the only reason there are terriosts is coz amercia's like in their country or UK anyone with me
    What leads you to believe that? In Vietnam, when we left did the north vietnamese stop attacking south Veitnam? They attacked us first, so why have it on our homeland when we can keep the fight over there?

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    Hmm good point but i mean veitnam was one hell of a war but i think that the US would of lost if they hadnt sent in necluer bombers since veitnam didnt use any planes as im sure of
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    Quote Originally Posted by mazo1 View Post
    Hmm good point but i mean veitnam was one hell of a war but i think that the US would of lost if they hadnt sent in necluer bombers since veitnam didnt use any planes as im sure of
    Youre thinking of WWII... We actually did "lose" vietnam, because we pulled out before the job was done (sounds eerily familiar, huh?)...

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    Youre thinking of WWII... We actually did "lose" vietnam, because we pulled out before the job was done (sounds eerily familiar, huh?)...
    a retreat is a forfit,
    a forfit is a loss.

    you guys lost.
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    Ye we did lose Veitnam i was sure but WW2 i mean tht was basically german vs Uk mostly but US sent us like resources to help us if the US wasnt there then i think we would of lost to be honest but we got help
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yakman View Post
    a retreat is a forfit,
    a forfit is a loss.

    you guys lost.
    Odd that people wanna do that now...

    Quote Originally Posted by mazo1 View Post
    Ye we did lose Veitnam i was sure but WW2 i mean tht was basically german vs Uk mostly but US sent us like resources to help us if the US wasnt there then i think we would of lost to be honest but we got help
    Not really, my grandfather fought in the pacific theater and it was just as horrible, if not worse (as far as the combat goes) over there. We got into the game very late (which was a mistake) but hey, it all worked out

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirlaughsalot View Post
    Odd that people wanna do that now...



    Not really, my grandfather fought in the pacific theater and it was just as horrible, if not worse (as far as the combat goes) over there. We got into the game very late (which was a mistake) but hey, it all worked out
    Yep if we lost WW2 then right now we woulda of been probly talkin german and marching in big boots
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